Sugars in tobacco, physical effects, and flue curing.

[Jpcouling]

Hi everyone! Glad to be a part of this forum! I recently just began growing this last summer and I have some Rustica and Samsun in my buddy's aquaponic system currently. My harvest of summer grown Small Stem Black Mammoth gave me some great tobacco which I sun cured, it has such a great unique "flowery" and herbal taste. Has anyone else experienced this? Since I only grew one plant I have a fairly small amount, and I am in a cigarette phase this winter, so I opted to buy some organic flue cured whole leaf. It is very nice stuff, but I have recently noticed that my body seems to act differently with this tobacco. My main theory is that the flue cured maintains the high sugar content while diminishing the alkaloid content to a degree. Sun curing and air curing seem to break down the sugars in to simpler elements, again, from the very low level of science I know. I am under the impression that sugars are somewhat harmful to health ( I'd believe it when you smell the noxious smell of burnt sugar!) and it seems that while my tobacco certainly has impact on my lungs, it is noticeably lighter and I do not get a tightness of the lungs and uncomfortable "gunk"with it like I do with the flue cured varieties that I have smoked through life and recently. I understand this is a subjective observation with my personal body chemistry but does anyone have any similar observations or science in the effect of high sugar smoke as opposed to air and sun curing? Thank you!

 

[grgfinney]

Hello fellow michigander i dont live too far from you welcome to the forum

 

[leverhead]

Welcome!

 

[winston-smoker]

Welcome! I don't know if added sugar is harmful, but I have read that there's a synergy between sugar and nicotine. Sugar apparently intensifies the effect of nicotine on brain chemistry.

 

[Rickey60]

Welcome. I am also looking forward to an answer to this question. Several people here can answer and should jump in soon.

 

[DGBAMA]

Hi everyone! Glad to be a part of this forum! I recently just began growing this last summer and I have some Rustica and Samsun in my buddy's aquaponic system currently. My harvest of summer grown Small Stem Black Mammoth gave me some great tobacco which I sun cured, it has such a great unique "flowery" and herbal taste. Has anyone else experienced this? Since I only grew one plant I have a fairly small amount, and I am in a cigarette phase this winter, so I opted to buy some organic flue cured whole leaf. It is very nice stuff, but I have recently noticed that my body seems to act differently with this tobacco. My main theory is that the flue cured maintains the high sugar content while diminishing the alkaloid content to a degree. Sun curing and air curing seem to break down the sugars in to simpler elements, again, from the very low level of science I know. I am under the impression that sugars are somewhat harmful to health ( I'd believe it when you smell the noxious smell of burnt sugar!) and it seems that while my tobacco certainly has impact on my lungs, it is noticeably lighter and I do not get a tightness of the lungs and uncomfortable "gunk"with it like I do with the flue cured varieties that I have smoked through life and recently. I understand this is a subjective observation with my personal body chemistry but does anyone have any similar observations or science in the effect of high sugar smoke as opposed to air and sun curing? Thank you!

Not sure how sugar content effects lungs, but as far as theory I beleive the highlighted part above is somewhat backwards. Tobacco leaf as harvested does not contain much in the way of sugars but rather carbohydrates/starches which can be converted to sugars. This is accomplished with the heat of the flue curing process; the heat of the process also breaks down nicotine, so the resulting tobacco is sweeter and lower in "vitamin N". Sun/air curing dries the leaf without converting carbs/starches to sugar or breaking down the nicotine in the leaf, resulting in a less sweet but higher nicotine tobacco. Non-fluecure varieties of tobacco contain less of the convertible carbs/starches so do not have as much "potential sweetness" as FlueCure varieties and so are not used for flue tobacco, but if flue cured will still be somewhat sweeter than air curing the same leaf. If you have high enough temps, sun curing partially converts carbs to sugar and gives a finished tobacco flavor somewhere inbetween Flue or Air cured.

One of the Veterans can feel free to kick me if I am wrong.

 

[Jpcouling]

No that really makes sense! I had forgotten about how the starches become sugars, but that really does help me understand the process a bit more. Now that I think about it, when I smoke my sun cured tobacco, it often has little sparks and audible burning noises. Which I have never experienced anything quite like that in any other tobacco besides clove cigarettes! Maybe this effect might be due to the high starch and carb content? Thanks DGBAMA!

 

[Jpcouling]

Anyone else experience that "energy" with their tobaccos? Am I getting too cosmic?

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Flue cured varieties contain a lot of sucrosesters. It is these "sugars" that make a flue cured a flue cured. Burley's do not have any sucrosesters. Turkish has varying amounts from none to moderate. When tobacco is flue cured, and to a lesser extent sun cured, the heat sets the sucrosester levels preventing them from decreasing. It is this natural "sugar" level in the leaf that contributes to the smotthness of a cigarette. The "sugar" causes the pH of the tobacco to become more acidic as it burns. The more acidic smoke makes it smoother tasting and helps to release nicotine once it hits the lungs.

 

[Jpcouling]

Thank you. I do see some correlation between my enjoyment of varieties of tobacco and the sweetness and curing method of the leaf. I seem to prefer the less sweet in many regards, give me more Vitamin N per gram! Anybody have any thoughts on the energy release of homegrown tobacco? Audible burning sounds and little "sparks" for lack of a better term?

 

[Knucklehead]

some "sweetness" talk: http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/1253-Flue-Cured-process

 

[TheNewestOldtimer]

Flue cured varieties contain a lot of sucrosesters. It is these "sugars" that make a flue cured a flue cured. Burley's do not have any sucrosesters. Turkish has varying amounts from none to moderate. When tobacco is flue cured, and to a lesser extent sun cured, the heat sets the sucrosester levels preventing them from decreasing. It is this natural "sugar" level in the leaf that contributes to the smotthness of a cigarette. The "sugar" causes the pH of the tobacco to become more acidic as it burns. The more acidic smoke makes it smoother tasting and helps to release nicotine once it hits the lungs.

Actually acidic smoke adsorbs less than neutral or alkaline smoke. Acidic things do not tend to "slip" through cell membranes, where as alkaline compounds can penetrate through a cell membrane with relative ease. This is why when you get contaminated with HCL it is not a very big deal you can usually wash it off and not suffer many long term issues. Caustic soda (sodium hydroxide) on the other hand actually goes into the tissue causing lots of damage, and the caustic soda can not be simply washed off like the acid can. I believe that nicotine it usually exist naturally in the Nicotine HCL form, but when put in alkaline condition it can loose the HCL becoming free form or freebase nicotine. Freebased nicotine is far more potent and bio-available. This is why tobacco giants can claim to add no nicotine while still making the tobacco stronger and more addictive. The freebase nicotine vs nicotine HCL is the same kind of difference as cocaine powder and crack. The process of making the strength of your tobacco consistently what you want by free basing is known as Nicotine management. So to sum it all up more alkaline smoke= more freebase nicotine and more bio-availability. Also if I recall correctly freebase nicotine has a lower melting/boiling point than nicotine HCL does meaning more of the nicotine from you tobacco goes into the smoke and less of it gets burnt.

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Actually acidic smoke adsorbs less than neutral or alkaline smoke.

This is correct! The acidic smoke has less available nicotine but has less impact on the throat. When the smoke is inhaled and enters the lungs the pH changes thus increasing the nicotine absorption.

 

[deluxestogie]

I'll add that acidic tobacco smoke (cigarette smoke) is absorbed very little by the mouth and nasopharynx, but is absorbed fairly well by the lining cells of the alveoli in the lungs. By contrast, the more alkaline smoke of cigars is easily absorbed by the mouth and nasopharynx. This explains why cigarette smokers almost universally inhale, whereas cigar smokers often do not. [Pressure-cured tobacco--Perique--is alkaline, and raises the pH of a pipe blend. While acidic smoke tends to cause tongue bite, the addition of Perique eliminates the tongue bite of flue-cured tobacco.]

From many discussions with regular cigarette smokers and regular cigar smokers, I have the impression that the former tend to prefer a pipe tobacco that is somewhat acidic, while the latter seem to prefer a pipe blend that is more alkaline.

Bob

 

[TheNewestOldtimer]

When the smoke is inhaled and enters the lungs the pH changes thus increasing the nicotine absorption.

Why would the ph change when it enters the lungs? In what direction? The only microscopic change in ph that I can hypothesize would be the ph going down (more alkaline or basic) due to CO2 combining with water to make H2CO3 (carbonic acid). I don't see how any considerable amount hydroxide ions can be formed when the smoke enters the lungs. I am not saying that you are wrong, but I am not currently aware of any mechanism to cause such a change.

 

[Jitterbugdude]

Why would the ph change when it enters the lungs? .

It's best explained in the following article from "Handbook of Experimental Pharmacology" by Benowitz, Hukkanen and Jacob

Nicotine is distilled from burning tobacco and carried proximally on tar droplets (also called particulate matter), which are inhaled. Absorption of nicotine across biological membranes depends on pH. Nicotine is a weak base with a pKa of 8.0. In its ionized state, such as in acidic environments, nicotine does not rapidly cross membranes. The pH of smoke from flue-cured tobaccos, found in most cigarettes, is acidic (pH 5.5–6.0). At this pH, nicotine is primarily ionized. As a consequence, there is little buccal absorption of nicotine from flue-cured tobacco smoke, even when it is held in the mouth (Gori et al. 1986). Smoke from air-cured tobaccos, the predominant tobacco used in pipes, cigars, and some European cigarettes, is more alkaline (pH 6.5 or higher) and, considerable nicotine is unionized. Smoke from these products is well absorbed through the mouth (Armitage et al. 1978). It has recently been proposed that the pH of cigarette smoke particulate matter is higher than previously thought, and thus, a larger portion of nicotine would be in the unionized form, facilitating rapid pulmonary absorption (Pankow 2001).

When tobacco smoke reaches the small airways and alveoli of the lung, nicotine is rapidly absorbed. Blood concentrations of nicotine rise quickly during a smoke and peak at the completion of smoking (Fig. 2). The rapid absorption of nicotine from cigarette smoke through the lungs, presumably because of the huge surface area of the alveoli and small airways, and dissolution of nicotine in the fluid of pH 7.4 in the human lung facilitate transfer across membranes. After a puff, high levels of nicotine reach the brain in 10–20 s, faster than with intravenous administration, producing rapid behavioral reinforcement (Benowitz 1990). The rapidity of rise in nicotine levels permits the smoker to titrate the level of nicotine and related effects during smoking, and makes smoking the most reinforcing and dependence-producing form of nicotine administration (Henningfield and Keenan 1993).



Note too that the authors point out the pH of cigars is about 6.5. Most people have the misconception that cigars have an alkaline pH. This is not true, they typically have an acidic pH but not as acidic as cigarettes.

 

[istanbulin]

... I believe that nicotine it usually exist naturally in the Nicotine HCL form, ...

The main form of nicotine in tobacco is its carboxylic acid salts.

 

[Hasse SWE]

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