How much does the wrapper influence cigar flavour

[bohdan.zaremba]

I often hear that most of the cigar's flavour comes from the wrapper, and the importance of wrapper to filler ratio. This is usually in context of gordo vitola, somebody will claim that a thicker cigar's taste is muted due to the low wrapper to filler ratio.

Personally, I am skeptical. While I am sure that a wrapper contributes to the overall flavour, I cannot see how a single leaf can contribute to most of it. And in the gordo argument, if the flavour is muted, I would bet it's due to the manufacturer using a lower quality leaf to pad the diameter. Maybe I will be proven wrong, but right now the "wrapper to filler ratio" sounds more like marketing mystique.

This is my first season growing tobacco, and I'll be putting this claim to the test in due time. I am curious what this forum thinks about this claim though.

 

[GreenDragon]

I am firmly in the “wrapper is only for looks” camp. I’ve rolled several batches of cigars with the same core but varied only the wrapper. I could barely detect a difference between them. Full transparency I usually roll around a 50 gauge. On a 30 gauge it probably makes more of a difference.

 

[bohdan.zaremba]

I am firmly in the “wrapper is only for looks” camp. I’ve rolled several batches of cigars with the same core but varied only the wrapper. I could barely detect a difference between them. Full transparency I usually roll around a 50 gauge. On a 30 gauge it probably makes more of a difference.

Thanks for confirming my bias

 

[OrlandoJoe]

I have a terrible palate, but im an avid cigar smoker. At the end of the day, it's probably a meaningless question, but from here , I do gravitate again and again to wrapper varietal. So in my opinion maybe at least 50%

 

[Luacino]

I think it depends on your blending style.

Some people like a tasteless but visually appealing wrapper, while others prefer a full-bodied, robust wrapper.

However, the quality of the wrapper definitely affects the experience; the oiliness of the wrapper is very pronounced.

Sometimes, a mismatch between the wrapper and other parts can make the cigar's flavor very vague, with nothing standing out.

 

[WillQuantrill]

I am firmly in the “wrapper is only for looks” camp. I’ve rolled several batches of cigars with the same core but varied only the wrapper. I could barely detect a difference between them. Full transparency I usually roll around a 50 gauge. On a 30 gauge it probably makes more of a difference.

I believe this is why the Corona vitola is supreme and the folks making cigars intuitively knew that a century ago. The perfect symbiosis of wrapper influence on binder and filler (disclaimer: I have no way of scientifically proving that). Although it is a solid experiment to smoke varied sizes of the same blend to note profile change which in some cases is quite drastic. In my humble opinion blending is much more nuanced than using an absolute value to wrapper influence, although such a value would speed up the process. At least in my own experiments it has alot more to do with many adjustments to a specific type of profile Im targeting. And sometimes, you just get lucky.

 

[bohdan.zaremba]

Thank you all for the opinions. I'm looking forward to putting this to a test

 

[deluxestogie]

Keys to a meaningful answer, you will need to standardize:

• tobacco growing location
• tobacco growing season
• fertilization schedule
• harvesting methods
• tobacco color-curing conditions
• tobacco aging temperature and humidity
• filler varieties with standardized priming level and leaf age
• binder variety with standardized priming level and leaf thickness and age
• wrapper variety with standardized priming level and leaf thickness and age
• combustibility of each component
• cigar filler density
• cigar cross-section (ring)
• cigar length
• cigar glue
• ignition method (e.g. burning match vs. burning gas)
• ambient smoking temperature
• ambient smoking relative humidity
• opening cut of the head
• human smoker (draw intensity, duration per puff and puff frequency)
• pre-smoke diet, beverage and ambient aroma

And don't forget about Bernoulli! Both the taste and aroma of a lit cigar vary by each puff, and vary significantly by the temperature of the combustion which, in turn, is impacted by the flow rate of air (and humidity) through the remaining length of increasingly moist tobacco.

Bob

 

[bohdan.zaremba]

Keys to a meaningful answer, you will need to standardize:

• tobacco growing location
• tobacco growing season
• fertilization schedule
• harvesting methods
• tobacco color-curing conditions
• tobacco aging temperature and humidity
• filler varieties with standardized priming level and leaf age
• binder variety with standardized priming level and leaf thickness and age
• wrapper variety with standardized priming level and leaf thickness and age
• combustibility of each component
• cigar filler density
• cigar cross-section (ring)
• cigar length
• cigar glue
• ignition method (e.g. burning match vs. burning gas)
• ambient smoking temperature
• ambient smoking relative humidity
• opening cut of the head
• human smoker (draw intensity, duration per puff and puff frequency)
• pre-smoke diet, beverage and ambient aroma

And don't forget about Bernoulli! Both the taste and aroma of a lit cigar vary by each puff, and vary significantly by the temperature of the combustion which, in turn, is impacted by the flow rate of air (and humidity) through the remaining length of increasingly moist tobacco.

Bob

Understood, this is a Sisyphean task

Joking aside though, it is possible to control some of these factors when home growing (fertilizer schedule, growing season and location, etc). For others, you'd need to roll a number of samples, and try to compare the averages between the two.

Perhaps the true takeaway here is "enjoy the smoke, and don't worry too much"

 

[deluxestogie]

"enjoy the smoke, and don't worry too much"

That's my conclusion as well. I've had different impressions of wrapper influence on my home-rolled, home-grown tobacco even when attempting to duplicate a cigar.

Bob

 

[Bamabaccy8a]

I often hear that most of the cigar's flavour comes from the wrapper, and the importance of wrapper to filler ratio. This is usually in context of gordo vitola, somebody will claim that a thicker cigar's taste is muted due to the low wrapper to filler ratio.

Personally, I am skeptical. While I am sure that a wrapper contributes to the overall flavour, I cannot see how a single leaf can contribute to most of it. And in the gordo argument, if the flavour is muted, I would bet it's due to the manufacturer using a lower quality leaf to pad the diameter. Maybe I will be proven wrong, but right now the "wrapper to filler ratio" sounds more like marketing mystique.

This is my first season growing tobacco, and I'll be putting this claim to the test in due time. I am curious what this forum thinks about this claim though. ,ive read the same. the wrapper only imparts taste onto the front of the tongue rather than in the more tasted inhaled smoke where i get the majority of flavors or notes

Imo, filler over wrapper. Wrapper does influence , initial sweetness maybe a little leatheriness , but the majority is in the filler where the notes of wood, leather, pepper, floral, grass.. etc are.

 

[StoneCarver]

Imo, the main contribution wrapper has on cigar taste is the fact that the wrapper comes in direct contact with your lips. None of the filler/binder does unless something horrible is going on with the cigar construction.

 

[UmbriaFarmer]

Keys to a meaningful answer, you will need to standardize:

• tobacco growing location
• tobacco growing season
• fertilization schedule
• harvesting methods
• tobacco color-curing conditions
• tobacco aging temperature and humidity
• filler varieties with standardized priming level and leaf age
• binder variety with standardized priming level and leaf thickness and age
• wrapper variety with standardized priming level and leaf thickness and age
• combustibility of each component
• cigar filler density
• cigar cross-section (ring)
• cigar length
• cigar glue
• ignition method (e.g. burning match vs. burning gas)
• ambient smoking temperature
• ambient smoking relative humidity
• opening cut of the head
• human smoker (draw intensity, duration per puff and puff frequency)
• pre-smoke diet, beverage and ambient aroma

And don't forget about Bernoulli! Both the taste and aroma of a lit cigar vary by each puff, and vary significantly by the temperature of the combustion which, in turn, is impacted by the flow rate of air (and humidity) through the remaining length of increasingly moist tobacco.

Bob

I'm a bit behind the 8 ball on this, only just found the thread, but I laughed when I read your comment Bob! So so so true. Every time I try to analyse a technical aspect of smoking a cigar, I end up getting mentally lost in the ever-expanding maze of potential variables. For example, if you really start to study tunneling, you head will eventually explode, it is so complex.

 

[WillQuantrill]

I found myself in a cigar lounge last night being fed this same old line about wrapper being the biggest influence on cigar flavor by the guy running the counter. He even went as far as to say filler leaf is almost a non-factor on body/flavor. I smiled and listened politely, but after the next 2 hours of enjoying my cigar and discussing tobacco I felt confident that when I left he realized there are folks out there that know quite a bit about the leaf without being in the industry. Not that I am an expert by any means, but it's funny how much more you learn if you jump into something and base knowledge in personal experience rather than others opinion. I was laughing to myself because my whole life I run into the same personality at the record store, gun shop or cigar lounge. Haha

 

[UmbriaFarmer]

I found myself in a cigar lounge last night being fed this same old line about wrapper being the biggest influence on cigar flavor by the guy running the counter. He even went as far as to say filler leaf is almost a non-factor on body/flavor. I smiled and listened politely, but after the next 2 hours of enjoying my cigar and discussing tobacco I felt confident that when I left he realized there are folks out there that know quite a bit about the leaf without being in the industry. Not that I am an expert by any means, but it's funny how much more you learn if you jump into something and base knowledge in personal experience rather than others opinion. I was laughing to myself because my whole life I run into the same personality at the record store, gun shop or cigar lounge. Haha

Couldn't agree more. I have, many times, noted considerable flavour changes in a blend just by swapping 1 out of 3 or 4 different fillers with a different one. Also I've noticed that when I've made fumas - a rollup of entirely one type of leaf to see what it brings to the table they are almost always pretty horrible. But put these three horrible fillers together and magic happens, which leads me to conclude it's what happens when filler burns in the company of others. One thing about wrappers that does seem to hold is that they create the aroma that comes of a smoldering cigar. When I waft a cigar under my nose, what I smell then is primarily wrapper driven. And re the experts, I personally know almost nobody who understands cigars as well as I do. Rolling them gives one a depth of understanding that those who've never rolled almost never have.

 

[bohdan.zaremba]

I found myself in a cigar lounge last night being fed this same old line about wrapper being the biggest influence on cigar flavor by the guy running the counter. He even went as far as to say filler leaf is almost a non-factor on body/flavor. I smiled and listened politely, but after the next 2 hours of enjoying my cigar and discussing tobacco I felt confident that when I left he realized there are folks out there that know quite a bit about the leaf without being in the industry. Not that I am an expert by any means, but it's funny how much more you learn if you jump into something and base knowledge in personal experience rather than others opinion. I was laughing to myself because my whole life I run into the same personality at the record store, gun shop or cigar lounge. Haha

I think this happens because an average cigar enjoyer is so far removed from the process of making cigars, that they have experience to judge the claims against. Thus, anything stated confidently goes. And places like reddit develop their own echo chambers and dogmas.

Deliberate misdirection from cigar companies doesn't help either. I guess you can charge more for a maduro wrapped cigar if it's a "special extensive fermentation process that only select leaves can go through without disintegrating" than "it's a bit more rare, but that's just the natural colour of the leaf after fermentation"

 

[bohdan.zaremba]

I'm a bit behind the 8 ball on this, only just found the thread, but I laughed when I read your comment Bob! So so so true. Every time I try to analyse a technical aspect of smoking a cigar, I end up getting mentally lost in the ever-expanding maze of potential variables. For example, if you really start to study tunneling, you head will eventually explode, it is so complex.

I was thinking about this. A decent comparison of an effect a wrapper has should be possible by simply splitting selected filler/binder leaves in halves, and using those halves for separate cigars.

 

[deluxestogie]

I found myself in a cigar lounge last night

If an employee or owner of a cigar retail outlet wishes to sell a $3 product for $25, then he (or she) better have a good story.

Bob