question about rolling cigars

[Smokin Harley]

I had a thought about this the other day , figured I'd ask the experts .
When you roll the bunch into the binder and then to the wrapper , is the binder and wrapper applied on the same angle (rt side + rt side leaves)or opposing angles(rt side +left side leaves) ? Does it matter ?

 

[deluxestogie]

You just need to make sure the veins of both the binder and wrapper are aligned with the long axis of the cigar, and the wrapper, once wrapped, exposes the "upper" (darker) surface of the leaf.

Bob

 

[Smokin Harley]

i understand those two points. Let me ask a different way, I was actually referring to the ...lets call it the "left hand roll vs left hand roll" for the two layers. So the rolling "spiral overlap" of the binder is completely covered by the wrapper in an opposite roll but still vein parallel to the finished cigar . Like ,should the binder and wrapper both be left hand of the stem (two different leaves) or could they in theory come from the same leaf using both left and right sides?

Ok Bob, how about this one then , maybe you covered it in your videos . do you roll from stem end to tip or vice versa? I'm thinking tip to stem end so theres a portion to use for the cap.
BTW, I bought an antique (looks like a perfecto)10 cigar mold on ebay , it shipped already. Should get it by Thursday.

 

[deluxestogie]

I don't do videos. Someone else's perhaps.

The stem is the central vein of a leaf. I assume you are referring to the stalk end.

For the first question, it doesn't matter about the binder. It can come from the same leaf as the wrapper, and just be flipped so that the "upper" surface is facing you, or you can use a matching leaf half for the binder.

I begin a cigar roll by placing the wrapper's leaf tip closest to me ("bottom" surface exposed), with the outer margin of the leaf forming the visible outer edge of the wrapper (rather than having the stem--vein--edge visible on the finished cigar). I begin with the foot of the bound bunch lying on the wrapper's tip, and then roll the cigar away from me, toward the head.

It turns out that the direction of the roll of the binder doesn't usually matter with the direction of the roll of the wrapper.

Set the new mold aside, until you have learned to roll smokable cigars by hand. The mold is a cosmetic appliance that may just complicate things. If a cigar won't smoke, then it doesn't matter how nice it looks.

Bob

 

[Gdaddy]

I don't think the 'spiral overlap' would add any benefit but if you like the idea then go for it.

There is something to be gained by placing all the leaves in the bunch all facing with the tips in one direction. Then when rolled in to the binder the bunch should be placed with the stalk ends on the stalk end of the binder.

The wrapper should be rolled starting at the leaf tip up to the stem. The foot of the cigar with all the best tobacco gets placed on the tip and rolled. The remaining unused stem end also has the largest/widest section for making the flag and cap.

This way all the richest tobacco of all the leaves will be mated together up towards the foot of the cigar (the part you smoke) and the weakest tobacco with be down at the head (the part you throw away). This is rarely talked about but will take your cigar to the next level and doesn't take any more time to roll the cigar. You just need to keep track of the which is the tip vs. the stem. Here's a tip... Lay all the leaves out with the tips facing in the proper direction before starting to roll so you don't lose track.

It's described in this video..

http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/4765-Cigar-rolling-test-2-paper-towels-to-real-tobacco


Look at the difference of the richness of the tip vs the stem...

 

[MarcL]

If I'm hearing you correctly, your asking about when binding from left to right, that cigar requires wrapping from right to left. If so, I have heard of this practice to help aid in retaining tension. It was explained to be like rope making science.

 

[deluxestogie]

That certainly makes sense, but doesn't seem to make a difference.

Bob

 

[Freeotatv]

I roll left to right for both binder and wrapper...not sure if reversing makes a diff..
My 3rd one came out excellent using a homemade cigar mold made from pine 2x6 with wing nuts/fender washers and long machine bolts all available at home depot.

i think using double leaves with the wrapper offer a solid structure...mine felt firm throughout and it was 8 inches long...nit sure of gauge but i used a 3/4 inch spade bit to drill the cigar mold..so it was a long fatty...

 

[rainmax]

Does it matter ?

In factories usually matters because it is the easiest way to get the most quality product in shortest time, but for you does not. If you are right handed you don't use only right side of the wrapper but you try to learn use left as well. From one leaf you can get half leaf binder (veins pointing out) and half leaf wrapper (veins pointing up). That way is wrapper applied on the same angle than binder. Sometimes you only have left side of the leaf in good condition. So binder will be opposite angle than wrapper. Also cuban professionals doesn't care about the angle. If you haven't see that video I recommend:

http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/4197-Rolling-Habanos

 

[Mad Oshea]

I roll both. Lft and rt. Foot to stem. Mad- I think AZD rolls stem to foot. I have some of His. Going to check it out. They look great. Better in person, than the pics. Mad- They are works of art..

 

[MarcL]

That certainly makes sense, but doesn't seem to make a difference.

Bob

It was Mario Perez of Joya De Nicaragua in a video I need to find. I think it more so had to do with thicker wrappers. I have noticed some difference at times.

In factories usually matters because it is the easiest way to get the most quality product in shortest time, but for you does not. If you are right handed you don't use only right side of the wrapper but you try to learn use left as well. From one leaf you can get half leaf binder (veins pointing out) and half leaf wrapper (veins pointing up). That way is wrapper applied on the same angle than binder. Sometimes you only have left side of the leaf in good condition. So binder will be opposite angle than wrapper. Also cuban professionals doesn't care about the angle. If you haven't see that video I recommend:

http://fairtradetobacco.com/threads/4197-Rolling-Habanos

In your video, the bound cigars are all left to right. She wraps the 1st one left to right and, 2 & 3 right to left I noticed.

 

[Freeotatv]

Ive used the dark air as a wrapper and it worked great...i had it n medium case and then used a rolling pin..it flattened the leaf and veins and offered a smooth amd pliable wrap...

 

[BarG]

If you have heavy veins on your wrapper flattening them will give a smoother finish for sure. Along with a tighter seal when stretched arond that assortment of cigar leaves.

 

[Gdaddy]

It was Mario Perez of Joya De Nicaragua in a video I need to find. I think it more so had to do with thicker wrappers. I have noticed some difference at times.



In your video, the bound cigars are all left to right. She wraps the 1st one left to right and, 2 & 3 right to left I noticed.

Did you notice that she takes all the leaves of the bunch running in one direction and places the filler tips matched on the tips of the binder. Then, once rolled, places them in the mold so the tips are up in the foot and the stalk tobacco is in the head.

She then places the foot of the cigar containing all the richest tobacco on the tip of the wrapper leaf.

All leaf tips are placed together throughout the roll on every cigar she does.

 

[Mad Oshea]

With that said BarG, I was thinking of a high-preasure roller to flaten the leaf. Some are good to roll with, but not smooth enough. ???

 

[Gdaddy]

Is this the video Marc?

Watch from about 7:30 he explains the importance of leaf orientation in the roll of the cigar.

 

[Gdaddy]

This is the video I saw posted a while back where he explains the direction of the leaf. Very important stuff and for some reason no one talks about it.

 

[BarG]

With that said BarG, I was thinking of a high-preasure roller to flaten the leaf. Some are good to roll with, but not smooth enough. ???

An old fashioned clothes wringer. They sell them for 75 bucks, I considered one for a pea peeler at one time.

 

[Mad Oshea]

No, It neads steal rollers with high preasure to smash it to the real flat stage is what I was thinking for a smooth roll.

 

[BarG]

Do you think it needs that much pressure?