Deciding on Varieties to Grow for Pipe Blending and Cigars

[JukkaPekka]

Growing tobacco is too much work, if the varieties you grow are not what you believe you purchased.

Some of the tobacco varietal listings on the suomensiemenpankki website appear questionable. For example, the photo of Samsun does not appear to be Samsun. There is a listing for "Baffra Basma", which is a meaningless term, since Bafra (near Samsun, on the Black Sea Coast) has a petiolate leaf stem attachment similar to that of Samsun, and Basma's leaf attachment is sessile (Xanthi, Izmir, etc.). The Samsun-like varieties (Samsun, Bafra, Trabzon, Katerini) have a similar taste and aroma. The Basma types offer a different taste and aroma.

[My suspicion falls upon the seed collection practices of the "home growers" who furnished their seed.]

If you are able to purchase seed from the US, I would suggest buying your tobacco seed from
Northwood Seeds.

Bob

Thank you for the reply.
I actually send message to Northwood seeds last weekend and asked what they would recommend for me but I have not yet got reply.
Their selection is so overwhelming that it´s hard to choose just 4-6 varieties suitable for pipe and Swedish snus.

J-P

 

[deluxestogie]

For pipe:

• Any flue-cured Virginia Type (@Knucklehead suggests Costello Negro for an air-cured Virginia)
• Any Oriental (I suggest Prilep 66-9/7)
• Any burley
• Any dark air-cured variety (my favorite is Little Yellow)

For snus, see the recipes (and variety suggestions) in the free book:

Snuff, Snus and Chew: a recipe book

Snuff, Snus and Chew: a recipe book edited by Robert C.A. Goff Front cover The FTT "Smokeless" forum is challenging to navigate. In August of 2022, I took on the task of collecting its Smokeless recipes for a dedicated book, not expecting the project to require more than a couple of months...

fairtradetobacco.com

Bob

 

[JukkaPekka]

I found out that ordering seeds ouside European Union is not possble without too much paperwork and paying 200USD for certificates.
If some of you can suggest seeds shop inside European Union that would be great.

J-P

 

[TigerTom]

Tabakanbau.de: Die Idee

Tabakanbau.de: Tabak selber anpflanzen - Webshop für Tabaksamen, Tabakpflanzsets u.a.: Die Idee

www.tabakanbau.de

Pretty sure Tabakenbau is located within the EU.

 

[deluxestogie]

too much paperwork

Contact Northwood Seeds about providing a phytosanitary certificate. The owner, @skychaser, is a longstanding member of this forum.

Bob

 

[JukkaPekka]

I think I will order from tillbudet.se since it`s near and delivers to Finland.
For pipe tobacco and Swedish snus I was thinkin these:

Tobaksfrö Virginia Gold FCV087. Förpackning om minst 60 frö.

www.tilbudet.se

Tobaksfrö Virginia Brightleaf Flue Cured

www.tilbudet.se

Tobaksfrö Prilep SUC152. Förpackning om minst 60 frö.

www.tilbudet.se

Tobaksfrö Green Briar BUR135. Förpackning om minst 60 frö.

www.tilbudet.se

Tobaksfrö Per-Pers

www.tilbudet.se

Tobaksfrö Alida DAC051

www.tilbudet.se

I am not sure if there is big difference between those virginias.

 

[RoperLegacyWoods]

I'd quite like to unpack the flue-cured/virginia variety a bit more. When buying a tin they tend to describe by color rather than varietal which to my mind begs the question if there is much benefit in growing one type over the other in terms of flavor? I'm doing Cherry Red this year but when cured will it really taste that different to Costello, Virginia Bright Leaf or another varietal?

I would also like an answer to this question. Many of my favorite commercial blends contain “red Virginia” or red-orange Virginia, or lemon yellow Virginia.
Can anyone help unlock this puzzle?

 

[deluxestogie]

If you look at the offerings from WLT:

Traditional Pipe Tobaccos

Traditional pipe tobaccos are often carefully integrated and treated to achieve flavor refinement that is often unavailable in other tobacco products.

wholeleaftobacco.com

Moving from lower stalk positions to upper stalk positions, you get "lemon", "bright", and "red" flue-cured Virginias. The lower positions are more acidic, and the higher positions offer a broader aroma profile and more nicotine.

Bob

 

[TigerTom]

I would also like an answer to this question. Many of my favorite commercial blends contain “red Virginia” or red-orange Virginia, or lemon yellow Virginia.
Can anyone help unlock this puzzle?

The second post of this thread might help:

Understanding American Virginia Types

Hello all. I am currently smoking Virginia Flue Cured Lemon, with about 20% Basma. I like it, and the nicotine level is good, but its a bit sweet. I'm looking accross a few websites, and finding a lot of different descriptions of Virginia Flu: lemon, orange, red, bright leaf smooth, bright leaf...

fairtradetobacco.com

As far as knowing the specific strains a commercial producer uses, it's anybody's guess. I imagine we would have to find out who produces, say, red virginia for someone like Cornell & Diehl, then go to the grower and ask what strain it is.

But experimentation is the the name of the game, and when we have a seed resource like Skychaser, well, the sky is the limit (yea...I said it).

 

[RoperLegacyWoods]

If you look at the offerings from WLT:

Traditional Pipe Tobaccos

Traditional pipe tobaccos are often carefully integrated and treated to achieve flavor refinement that is often unavailable in other tobacco products.

wholeleaftobacco.com

Moving from lower stalk positions to upper stalk positions, you get "lemon", "bright", and "red" flue-cured Virginias. The lower positions are more acidic, and the higher positions offer a broader aroma profile and more nicotine.

Bob

Thank you sir,
I’ll go over there and do some reading then make an order !

 

[deluxestogie]

ask what strain it is.

The American flue-cured tobacco market operates on the quality and grade of the leaf, rather than the specific Virginia variety that was flue-cured. So most commercial purchasers never know the variety—just the quality and grade

Old Belt Farmers Co-op Tobacco Auction 15 OCT 2019

I had the privilege of accompanying Don at a tobacco auction in Rural Hall, North Carolina, today. The Old Belt Farmers Co-op tobacco auction is one of the few remaining in the country, and the northernmost flue-cured tobacco auction that I know of in the US. [Danville, Virginia exists only...

fairtradetobacco.com

For deciding to grow a flue-cured variety, the most important decision is whether or not you plan to construct a flue-cure chamber. Without flue-curing your home-grown Virginia, you just end up with air-cured leaf that will not resemble flue-cured tobacco. (Sun-curing Virginia gets you somewhere in between air-cured and flue-cured.) Northwood Seeds offers many flue-cure varieties, which have different productivity and maturation dates.

Bob

 

[RoperLegacyWoods]

The American flue-cured tobacco market operates on the quality and grade of the leaf, rather than the specific Virginia variety that was flue-cured. So most commercial purchasers never know the variety—just the quality and grade

Old Belt Farmers Co-op Tobacco Auction 15 OCT 2019

I had the privilege of accompanying Don at a tobacco auction in Rural Hall, North Carolina, today. The Old Belt Farmers Co-op tobacco auction is one of the few remaining in the country, and the northernmost flue-cured tobacco auction that I know of in the US. [Danville, Virginia exists only...

fairtradetobacco.com

For deciding to grow a flue-cured variety, the most important decision is whether or not you plan to construct a flue-cure chamber. Without flue-curing your home-grown Virginia, you just end up with air-cured leaf that will not resemble flue-cured tobacco. (Sun-curing Virginia gets you somewhere in between air-cured and flue-cured.) Northwood Seeds offers many flue-cure varieties, which have different productivity and maturation dates.

Bob

Well that decides me, I’m building a flue cure chamber this winter. All my favorite commercial blends are Virginia, Virginia-Perique, or Virginia -orientals. So next season I’ll grow Virginias and orientals from the suggested list.
I’m re-reading your books and taking notes on your flue-chamber build threads.
Thank you for the generous gift of your time and knowledge.

 

[deluxestogie]

Thank you for your kind words. The real thanks goes to the many members of this forum who, by trial and error, collaborated in defining the processes of making Perique at home, and solving the challenges of flue-curing at home. While the industrial techniques had been established for well over a century, the small-scale approach was entirely a product of FTT forum members. Although we have also, together, clarified the processes of making Latakia at home, the hurdle in that process remains the acquisition of firing materials that provide Latakia's distinctive aromas, created by the slow combustion of plant woods and brush that are fairly unique to the Mediterranean basin, and difficult to obtain elsewhere.

Bob

 

[RoperLegacyWoods]

Thank you for your kind words. The real thanks goes to the many members of this forum who, by trial and error, collaborated in defining the processes of making Perique at home, and solving the challenges of flue-curing at home. While the industrial techniques had been established for well over a century, the small-scale approach was entirely a product of FTT forum members. Although we have also, together, clarified the processes of making Latakia at home, the hurdle in that process remains the acquisition of firing materials that provide Latakia's distinctive aromas, created by the slow combustion of plant woods and brush that are fairly unique to the Mediterranean basin, and difficult to obtain elsewhere.

Bob

Credit to all who participated of course
I’m looking forward to trying to make perique, maybe next year? For now, I went ahead and bought a pound from WLT with one of their pipe samplers and a cigar kit.