Deluxestogie sews his own bud bags from Agribon.
Robncars 2021 (and winter 2020) Grow
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There's Agribon, then there's Agribon. There are many grades, rated by their thickness. I use Agribon AG-15, which is the thinnest grade, and provides a few degrees of frost protection, though it is generally considered a insect protection.
It's available in 50' up to a gazillion feet. I usually purchase a 250' roll of it every 5 years or so, and use it for all sorts of stuff--bud bags, garlic bags, row cover, gift wrap.
Bob
It's available in 50' up to a gazillion feet. I usually purchase a 250' roll of it every 5 years or so, and use it for all sorts of stuff--bud bags, garlic bags, row cover, gift wrap.
Bob
Robncars
Well-Known Member
So I was reading up on bud bags and I got a couple questions.
How many plants or varieties would you say is average for most of you.
Im curious because I was seeing like 50 bud bags a season. I was thinking my 8 varieties was good and I was hoping for about 50 plants per variety but thats not going to happen this year ...anyway....
I use 50-60 plants a year as chewing tobacco at or near a (commercial) can a day. Thats 2 packs a day if the experts are to be believed. So a smoker would need like 25 plants a year. Plus 25 plants to keep your aging going on leaves. Mixing old and new you could conceivably hold back 1 hand and age it to say 25+ years.
By my estimate 50 bags is 25 million seeds. Am I missing a concept or does my math and calculations seem accurate?
How many plants or varieties would you say is average for most of you.
Im curious because I was seeing like 50 bud bags a season. I was thinking my 8 varieties was good and I was hoping for about 50 plants per variety but thats not going to happen this year ...anyway....
I use 50-60 plants a year as chewing tobacco at or near a (commercial) can a day. Thats 2 packs a day if the experts are to be believed. So a smoker would need like 25 plants a year. Plus 25 plants to keep your aging going on leaves. Mixing old and new you could conceivably hold back 1 hand and age it to say 25+ years.
By my estimate 50 bags is 25 million seeds. Am I missing a concept or does my math and calculations seem accurate?
Robncars
Well-Known Member
It's available in 50' up to a gazillion feet. I usually purchase a 250' roll of it every 5 years or so, and use it for all sorts of stuff--bud bags, garlic bags, row cover, gift wrap.
Bob
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Gift wrap huh? Seems like that wouldn't work as a surprise....
Bob
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Gift wrap huh? Seems like that wouldn't work as a surprise....
If you have eight varieties you only need to bag one plant of each variety to save for seed, so eight bud bags. You can bag two each to allow for blow downs, bud worms, oh crap moments, etc. With proper storage your seed can last up to ten years before needing to be refreshed. Your foremost concern in selecting which plant to bag should be that they hold true to type (your Prilep has every characteristic of Prilep and not Izmir, etc.) Then choose your best plant of each variety that holds true to type for that variety.
Robncars
Well-Known Member
Thats my understanding, my question i guess is 50 varieties normal? I'm assuming with that many even planting 5 each is more for cigars.
I don't believe that variety would make much of a difference in chewing tobacco.. considering its fermented
When I grew that many varieties it was to refresh seed for a massive seed grow out and some of the seed were getting old (a tobacco seed business went out of business). I grew four plants each of around seventy five varieties and bagged one plant of each variety for seed and it was not normal, it was insane. Next time I grow I’m going to keep the varieties down to a sane level, hopefully around five and buy seed from Skychaser.
Skychaser is my hero.
skychaser
Well-Known Member
lmao oh..kay.... Then I want a statue. And some streets named after me too. And maybe an parade.
One year when we were trying to build inventory we grew 106 varieties. Minimum off 20 plants per strain. I always grow at least 20 of each strain and usually more. I had over 2500 bagged plants. Keeping up with all those was bit of a challenge. But not compared to all the book keeping it took. I had to make 106 new field signs. We needed photos of each strain. Usually 3 sets during the growing season. We needed descriptions written for each, Lots of feild notes. We needed a plastic tote for each at harvest time and each had to be labeled. All of them had to be kept separated until they were bone dry for threshing. When threshing and cleaning only one strain is brought out at a time. Lots more labels to make for bags. I made a scaled down version of a garbage can sunflower seed thresher I saw on line to break up the seed heads and pods. It works great and step one starts there. Then everything goes through a bucket screen to remove the bigger chaff. Then to finer and finer screens and finally into a plastic gold pan a few ounces at a time for air blowing to remove the last chaff. Everything is blown again later one final time before it is sold. Several plastic buckets and plastic pans, and a few other things are involved along the way. Threshing is always done outside because some of the chaff is just plain nasty and open air is a must. The first thing that goes down on the ground is a new blue tarp. A safety trap in case of spillage. (learned that the hard way) When the seed is finally cleaned and bagged, everything must get a very through cleaning with high pressure air right down to the safety tarp, the people doing the cleaning and the chairs we sit in. Those tiny seeds can stick to anything so being super clean is a must. When done the tarp goes back down and a new strain comes out and it all starts over again. 106 times that year. It took a month. arghhh We swore we would never do more than 40 in one year again. This year I only have 22 strains with 25 to 40 plants of each. But I am growing several other things too.
Re-reading this over, it does start to sound like a lot of work. Maybe I do deserve a parade.
Robncars
Well-Known Member
Re-reading this over, it does start to sound like a lot of work. Maybe I do deserve a parade.
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It almost broke me of saving seed. Im going to try 1 or 2 but I have enough learning to do that I dont think seed saving is going to be a top priority this year anymore. I did sew up 4 bud bags from light floating row cover frost protection. Agribon but not. Pretty easy with a sewing machine.
From 2 weeks ago now. That multi stem (i now think is madole doesn't matter i wont save seed) regrew several full size leaves already. I might clip him down to 1 stalk and let a sucker grow then transplant him back into the house. IDK maybe
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It almost broke me of saving seed. Im going to try 1 or 2 but I have enough learning to do that I dont think seed saving is going to be a top priority this year anymore. I did sew up 4 bud bags from light floating row cover frost protection. Agribon but not. Pretty easy with a sewing machine.
From 2 weeks ago now. That multi stem (i now think is madole doesn't matter i wont save seed) regrew several full size leaves already. I might clip him down to 1 stalk and let a sucker grow then transplant him back into the house. IDK maybe
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Robncars
Well-Known Member
A look at the garden today.
Some Big Gem in the foreground. That is a staghorn in the back with a bud bags on it.
A Small Stalk Black Mammoth. Im definitely growing that one again!
Incekara. Idk about that one. Maybe. Depends on how it affects quality.
Rustica. Small with few leaves. But definitely rustica.
Tomatoes. They are pushing my flimsy cages over. 6' shovel for comparison. Had to add them.
Some Big Gem in the foreground. That is a staghorn in the back with a bud bags on it.
A Small Stalk Black Mammoth. Im definitely growing that one again!
Incekara. Idk about that one. Maybe. Depends on how it affects quality.
Rustica. Small with few leaves. But definitely rustica.
Tomatoes. They are pushing my flimsy cages over. 6' shovel for comparison. Had to add them.
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Robncars
Well-Known Member
So I experimented with my rustica. I froze the leaves before I put them in the flue chamber. It was a thought from last years frost hit plants. Probably too frozen but we will see
Robncars
Well-Known Member
This year seems a lot harder to yellow the leaves. I waited 2 weeks after topping and they had aligatored nicely. But they refuse to yellow properly. I have good airflow but its hard keeping 80%. Stays around 65%. Its not bad considering outside is 15-20% humidity. Just might take a bit to wilt and yellow them.
The Rustica?
Robncars
Well-Known Member
No I knew the rustica was going to be different. Im experimenting with those. My Small Stalk Black Mammoth and staghorn is in the 3rd day of wilting with minimal yellowing
What are you using to maintain 65-80% humidity if it is 15-20% outside? Humidifiers, misting the leaf, towels in buckets, etc? How much yellow did the leaves have when you harvested (what stage of maturity)? Are they bunched tightly together, loosely bunched, or spread out? It may just be a matter of the dark air and dark Virginia varieties holding so much moisture within the stem and lamina to begin with. Mine had huge honking stems and leaves, but I harvested them at the over ripe stage so our starting places were probably different. (I’m assuming you primed mature, I primed at ripe) My leaves were very yellow with some of the tips beginning to turn brown, so really over ripe. They cured really well, but slowly, even though very yellow at harvest time.
This photo is the day I did my second priming of VA355 dark air.
2015 Knucklehead Grow Blog
What did you think about the K326 you grew? I'm growing some this year that I got from Larry, but I don't know anything about it other than it is a flue cure Bright leaf. It was okay, but I air cured it. I've sun cured all my flue cure varieties for the past two years and prefer that method. I...
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Robncars
Well-Known Member
Mine had aligatored. Mature but not quite into ripe. I was afraid the grasshoppers would have the buffet stripped before I got to ripe
Robncars
Well-Known Member
More loosely bunched. I packed what I had ready but it wasn't a full chamber. I have a pot of water and I've been spraying the leaves with a water hose to bring it up.
Robncars
Well-Known Member
So if im reading you right (they had massive stems in the SSBM) I may need to adjust my wilt and yellow time for them. Just let them color before I start curing. Don't hurry dont worry?
Robncars
Well-Known Member
And 1 more question just cause I'm curious- anybody know what variety produces the biggest leaf and how big is it?
My mammoths are nice. 18x20 green
My mammoths are nice. 18x20 green
So the leaves are in a closed chamber like a kiln but at air curing conditions? That will work well when the climate isn’t cooperating. I have to battle the climate, too, at harvest time. Temps are great but big humidity swings. Are you venting your chamber? They are putting out a lot of moisture now. If that’s okay I would just keep feeling the leaf and watch.
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